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[QUOTE=alaskaitaly]I've read the other thread on Codice Fiscale..but a bit confused.

Can you get a codice fiscale from a website?

From what I've read, it appears that you do not need a permesso sogiorno...true?

I know that I got mine 4 years ago without a permesso.

Thanks for any help!:o[/QUOTE]

First, you do not need to have an address in Italy, a Permesso or any other piece of official ½ûÂþÌìÌà documentation in order to get a Codice Fiscale. The CF is actually the first step towards getting all this other stuff.

There are websites where you can put in your personal details and [I]a[/I] Codice Fiscale is generated. The code is, after all, created using very simple rules based on just name, date and place of birth.

[I]However[/I], this is not an officially allocated code. In order to get a real CF and have your details entered in the ½ûÂþÌìÌà tax system, you need to either visit the appropriate office while in Italy or contact an ½ûÂþÌìÌà embassy or consulate. (From what I've seen, it appears they do use a website to enter your information and request a card and notification letter, but the website they use cannot be accessed by the general public.)

Al

Allan, not exactly, if you are in Italy they do want an address. I also have helped people get their codice fiscale and have been told over and over again that they need both a passport and a PdiS. They really just want the PdiS for the address so if you have proof of another address they will probably let you slide. I have given mine for other people and that has seemed to suffice.

I have updated my page on this subject and it can be found here [url]http://www.expatsinitaly.com/arrival/codicefiscale.htm[/url] and that should answer your questions alaska.

[QUOTE=AllanMason]First, you do not need to have an address in Italy, a Permesso or any other piece of official ½ûÂþÌìÌà documentation in order to get a Codice Fiscale. The CF is actually the first step towards getting all this other stuff.

There are websites where you can put in your personal details and [I]a[/I] Codice Fiscale is generated. The code is, after all, created using very simple rules based on just name, date and place of birth.

[I]However[/I], this is not an officially allocated code. In order to get a real CF and have your details entered in the ½ûÂþÌìÌà tax system, you need to either visit the appropriate office while in Italy or contact an ½ûÂþÌìÌà embassy or consulate. (From what I've seen, it appears they do use a website to enter your information and request a card and notification letter, but the website they use cannot be accessed by the general public.)

Al[/QUOTE]

If getting the unofficial Codice Fiscale from a website it is important to enter your name as it appears on your passport, if you omit a middle name it will generate a different code to the one that officialdom will anoint you with.

[QUOTE=cristina]Allan, not exactly, if you are in Italy they do want an address. I also have helped people get their codice fiscale and have been told over and over again that they need both a passport and a PdiS. They really just want the PdiS for the address so if you have proof of another address they will probably let you slide. I have given mine for other people and that has seemed to suffice.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, I should have qualified my statement. The form I was sent by the local consulate had a box asking for foreign address.

However, there is something I've wondered about. If a non-½ûÂþÌìÌà applies for a Codice Fiscale and is told that they need an address, what would happen if it was gently pointed out to the official that this was clearly an absurd rule since one can't obtain a home address in Italy unless one first has a codice fiscale. One would, of course, emphasise that it was not the offical who was ignorant of all the provisions of the rules, but rather that it was the regulations which are very obviously silly.

Seems to me there are then two possibilities. First, the response might be what would typically happen in Britain: the official shrugs, says "rules is rules" and calls for the next victim in the queue.

Or, there might be the stereotypical ½ûÂþÌìÌà response to regulations: an effort to find some way around the obstacle that complies with the rules in some sense, but also gives the applicant what they are seeking and leaves the offical with a feeling of having demonstrated their mastery of The System in doing someone a favour.

Which is, I suppose, what you seem to be describing as having happened.

Al

In all honesty, you do not have to own a property to have an address. My first address here was a student apartment. I jsut used that as my address even though I did not have a contract and it was only for 3 months.

people apply for and get code fiscale without an italian address.... its something you can apply for from home...in your native language through any embassey....

i still do not have a permesso after two years here ...i do have residency... which i didnt apply for ... i do have a code fiscale which some person from HAI in abruzzo charged me for...before i knew i could do it for free.... i did try to get a permesso but was told to go away as i was an eu citizen and they couldnt be bothered ... they had too many problems with non eu citizens...

there are no rules apart from the rule that you have to know the rules... and then you can do what you want... if any italian policeman came along to me and suggested i needed a permesso to stay here i would suggest to him that i would in fact be going to the eu court to contest his opinion... italy is in breach of several eu directives on its refusal to accept the rules it has signed up to....

i do not suggest anyone else takeing my route... but get a code fiscale...residency ...if you happen to want to live here permanentley and worry about the rest as they come up... oh yes i have some health card as well... ...

the controls are in place for other nationals .... not eu citizens... and come an arguement they would have trouble... all an italian needs is the code fiscale and residency...and as an eu citizen thats all i need ... because i am the same as an italian... a citizen of the eu....

i have lived in several european countries before any eu thoughts and standardisation... if you go looking for trouble it will find you.... do the basics and enjoy life here without worrying too much about what you can and cannot do as regards heaps of paper....

any italian official noticing this posting that wants to have me thrown out.... bring it on as they say... i would welcome the diversion

As I indicated on the previous thread, what the regulations say is one thing, and what actually happens in the local tax office is another thing. Unfortunately, few of the clerks in the tax offices in Italy really know the rules and they will never take responisbility for doing something they are not sure about. Hence it is always necessary to provide an address (even a friends), and a name that matches your passport. If applying from Britain you can state that your residence is abroad and not give an ½ûÂþÌìÌà address. Other than that, it is simple. Phil

Thanks for all the information.

I found the codice fiscale the easiest thing I have had to get in Italy...but a friend needs one and was concerned about not having a permesso.