Affordable?
Submitted by cardi on Tue, 07/31/2012 - 17:02
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
affordable ?
Submitted by Ugo on Wed, 08/01/2012 - 04:27
In reply to Affordable? by cardi
Ugo, I believe Cardi means
Submitted by Esme on Wed, 08/01/2012 - 07:20
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
I paid about 1k euro/msq for
Submitted by stefanaccio on Wed, 08/01/2012 - 07:50
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Affordable , prices, and phtos
Submitted by Ugo on Wed, 08/01/2012 - 08:27
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
it is certainly possible to find a home in Italy, restored, with 5000 square meters of land, at a price less than 670 euros per sq. meter, with two hot tubs, heating system, electrical and plumbing, separate for each floor, 6 bathrooms, 3 kitchens , all new windows, alarm system on the first floor, electrical safety, drinking water reservoir for 2000-liri, reservoir for water from the roofs of 4000-liters - the gas tank of 2000-liters - .. cardi , gently , give us some links .... I have made available the technical expertise of the court in Perugia, 749,000-euro value - I can show it to all people seriously interested in buying the property, who will come to visit. Photos of the house , have at link showed in first message - unbelievers can see -
Beautiful house and features
Submitted by Lorraine on Wed, 08/01/2012 - 09:19
In reply to Affordable , prices, and phtos by Ugo
The sinks are
Submitted by Angie and Robert on Wed, 08/01/2012 - 09:53
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Ifo for all, as my job is mortgage broker , it was my first concern, to find a bank willing to finance the purchase of this property. I find an bank available to provide a mortgage to foreign buyers/borrowers up to a maximum of 60% of the sale price - so 240,000-euro - Anyone interested can find more information about the possibility of having a mortgage in Italy, in my site web - or simply mailing me a private message on this website.
Rather OTT Ugo. Were they
Submitted by Badger on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 09:21
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
restoration ?
Submitted by Ugo on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 12:26
In reply to Rather OTT Ugo. Were they by Badger
Lovely pictures. Sad but
Submitted by Penny on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 11:12
In reply to Rather OTT Ugo. Were they by Badger
In reply to Lovely pictures. Sad but by Penny
Penny , Interesting article, but this is not the right place to develop it - With regard to German policy, you may find that those who currently has the scepter of command in that country, comes from the geographic mid who was denied the full table of the Marshall Plan, and therefore is pursuing, even today, a desire for revenge. Unfortunately, using the same principle that led the country twice to defeat > take and not to re-pay - We have now reached the third time, this long movie, I guess all have memories of when Germany demanded and obtained greater elasticity to Europe, to give the two "MARCHI", the same purchase value. Now it's time to repay. And they, as usual, have a short memory. Fortunately, the gas comes from Russia ….. 
Very true and house prices
Submitted by AndyT on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 13:14
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Very true and house prices continue to be a lottery in Italy. At the end of the day, it's only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it and right now, with the Euro teetering on the brink of collapse, someone from outside the Eurozone could sink a load of cash into this only to find in years to come that it's worth 10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 lira - about £25! Noone in their right mind is putting Sterling into Euro investments whilst these bankrupt economies continue to die an ever-more-likely slow death.
In reply to Very true and house prices by AndyT
To be honest Ugo. Think
Submitted by Badger on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 13:28
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
To be honest Ugo. Think whoever was restoring that property, was trying to create a palazzo in a normal house and failed. With the price, it looks like a mortgage reposession and are trying to recoup their expenditure. It is very much like the London set, who had to have Roman style porticos to their houses.
in reply to yr's message
Submitted by Ugo on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 14:31
In reply to To be honest Ugo. Think by Badger
Badger , Sometimes what appears to have nothing to do with reality, the reasons why a homeowner does not pay the mortgage, may have nothing to do with their disposable income, sometimes the cause is simply a fight between owners ... - You can not make judgments, if you do not know why.
I very much doubt that the
Submitted by AndyT on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 14:45
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
I very much doubt that the Pound will collapse. One thing about the British is that the majority will accept that there's a mountain to climb financially and they understand that they will have to pay a little more. I'm not so sure Italy will accept austerity, that everyone will happily pay their 'full' taxes & that the politicians will stop bleeding the country dry by lining their own pockets. I cannot believe just how many people are able to drive high end cars here when the 'effective' tax rates are as high as anywhere in Europe & far, far higher than the UK. It's a bit like Greece where there are more Porsche owners than people who 'declare' incomes of €50,000 or more.
In reply to I very much doubt that the by AndyT
Andy , Time will tell, Italy has passed tests worse. the England of today is not made up of only English, indeed, they are probably the least part of the population, I in your place, I would not feel so comfortable that people who live in the england today, are available to eat foxes . Unlike the s eat pasta and tomatoes, and even with pleasure. My neighbor says that if he had pasta every day, you feel truly poor. She has a dress for winter and one for summer, a car in the garage, the beach house, two apartments in the city where his daughters live with their husbands and children, he lives with his wife and sister who definitely no longer be married: 82 years ago, and i assure you it is a happy man - like many more s You all have a nasty habit of blindly believing what is written in the newspapers. Journalists write news that sell newspapers, because newspapers thrive on publicity: that strange thing that causes many to die of hunger with the latest ipad in hand. However, in most cases the reality is DIFFERENT.
In reply to I very much doubt that the by AndyT
Now this is a reply specifically to Andy T (apologies to those few who read in threaded view!) Your comments about 'high end cars' - of course, the same is true of Greece - remind me of the 1960's when 'every' council house tenant had a cocktail cabinet and a TV, and it 'wasn't right'! But in those days, there were credit controls, and you could only get a bit of a Porsche on HP. Ask yourself who made the credit available to the spendthrift Greeks and s - Daimler Benz, Porsche, BMW - predominantly German firms acting as bankers, and luring newbie borrowers with siren calls. Okay, the borrowers should have been more sensible - like people should not gorge themselves on MacDonald's burgers or immense Colas - but when the advertising is overwhelming it takes a Saint to resist. Of course, wedging everybody into a common currency (the euro) was bound to end in tears - but it is less than surprising that the politicians who forced this through are now trying to protect (at, it seems, all costs) the imbecile currency rather than their populations. We haven't even exited the starting gate yet, but I would not be too sanguine about the prospects for Sterling.
Was not making a judgement
Submitted by Badger on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 15:39
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
business..
Submitted by Ugo on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 15:57
In reply to Was not making a judgement by Badger
Badger ! good, very good, it is fitting that the euro will fall, and the British with a super evaluated pounds buying o properties in Italy, so finally, I ITALIAN, will I stop paying taxes and travel on my ferrari yellow, taxes for me, to pay the British owners of the houses 
two counts
Submitted by Ugo on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 16:05
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Andy , the standard italian family is composed by : - man = 1200-euro monthly-net/net - wife = 1200-euro monthly-net/net , or at last 600 monthy ( black) - one children -one grand mater or phater = 1000-euro pension net/net home in property (70% of the italians have its home ) to you the calculation...
And to start a business in
Submitted by AndyT on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 16:27
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
And to start a business in Italy Ugo, some sums for year 1: Profit €5000. Tax, INPS & Account payment for next year €4400. Accountancy Bill €800. er....which means that despite barely earning anything, you owe the goverment €200 and have nothing to live on. Hmm...Is it any wonder why noone wishes to start a business in Italy? That's hardly likely to stimulate the economy.
In reply to And to start a business in by AndyT
Andy , Iceland has stimulated the economy a few years ago, the results are under the eye of all - there is now Romania, which encourages all open their Caal center there - But of course, Italy has a need for simplification and the only way to obtain it is a new electoral law> Members must have an age between 18 and 30 - senators from 25 to 40 - would be better if you did a two-room dining, so the meaning would be more evident
What......
Submitted by Flip on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 16:40
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
What is the point of all this Ugo ? Trying to justify the value of a property in the current financial climate is bonkers; firstly if a person has a disposable amount of € 400k then I doubt the fact of the weak Euro bothers them one iota, or the likely hood of a Euro crash. The house is worth what someone will give you for it no matter what anyone 'values' it at. To get wound up about the rights and wrongs of a house valuation( quite nice is looks as well) is pointless and as a closet Estate Agent you should have thick skin!! Just advertise your wares and get on with it; but be prepared for the English Cynicism.
It's a bargain!
Submitted by Fillide on Thu, 08/02/2012 - 19:42
In reply to What...... by Flip
By anybody's criteria (given today's real estate prices) that house in Collevalenza is a bargain. Whether it is a good investment is debatable - iit depends on your view of the possible developments in any national or international property market, and your longer term views on currencies I suppose - but if you are even marginally bullish about property, and fancy an impressive pad in Umbria, it is a no brainer. Probably it is being offered at an affordable price because it is a forced sale, although Ugo also alluded to some bureaucratic niceties that needed tidying up - presumably paid for by the seller (though if that is Equitalia maybe not!) Anyway, I'd recommend viewing it (with the caveat of the catastal stuff) to anyone looking for a fancy gaff in Umbria, even if they were looking for a property at twice the price.
In reply to It's a bargain! by Fillide
Fillide , clearly i can't post here the land records, deeds of origin, legal and other procedures. But I have no problem showing copies of all documents and explain in detail the procedures for acquisition, to anyone who comes to see the house. If then this person will bring a lawyer, this is better! > I can I put the contact with the notary who was responsible for the transfer of ownership - all operations necessary for the transfer shall be borne by the seller, excluding the payment of transfer taxes, and recording the compromesso , as required by law. My office is operating under the general powers of attorney duly registered and I do not are a real estate agent . to me nothing is due from buyer for the purchasing of this property. As for a possible bank loan necessary to the buyer, I can lend my work: : of course I would not do this for the glory:) . On my website all can see my licences , procedures , and have first information about mortgage in italy to non-italians.
In reply to What...... by Flip
Andy T Apologies to Ugo for
Submitted by Pat H on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 07:05
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Andy T Apologies to Ugo for this off topic posts but at least they keep the thread alive I am afraid that I don’t see it like that at all. I also feel that the pound will not collapse but looking at the pound against other currencies over the last few years, it is clear that sentiment does not believe that the UK economy is strong. The problem with italy is not the people it is the government. personal debt is amongst the lowest in the EU. personal savings amongst the highest in the world (and both are in far better shape than the UK). This graphic (although drawn on statistics in 2007) illustrates the debt issue well. I also doubt very much the majority will continue to want to pay their way while politicians woefully mismanage the reforms. The huge mountains to climb in the UK (reform of the welfare system, NHS fraud, very low public service productivity, woeful manufacturing base, over reliance on the banking sector etc etc ) have not even slightly been tackled. Instead the government have taken shots at the easy targets, the army, the police etc etc and they can’t even do this properly. Also remember that there is an election coming; all the people who have lost their jobs, their hospitals etc etc will probably not be voting for the coalition again. (Turkeys and Christmas) We are all cursed by politics which gives us politicians running the country and only their degrees of corruption vary. 
Tarallucci & Vino
Submitted by Ugo on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 08:06
In reply to Andy T Apologies to Ugo for by Pat H
Andy, the government of a nation is a little like the mirror of the people who inhabit it. It is useless to hide behind his own shadow, the politician makes promises that knows he can not keep, to receive payment for voting - that allows a life above the average - is ready to close both eyes for the misdeeds of those who voted - the voter, for his part, knows that his requests are never fulfilled, but relies on the fact that those who must control his eyes jug from birth. This technique has an ancient name, is called Clientelismo (patronage) . and in Italy was the base on which the Government of the Republic of Rome. Now, you know that Rome was to bring – first time - the state , in England , and not vice versa - I leave you to draw the consequences . Regarding the graphics , they are a typical Anglo-Saxon art .. we are more likely the policy of "Tarallucci and Wine"
Well, I think the only
Submitted by Esme on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 10:10
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
grande per due ..ma
Submitted by Ugo on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 11:22
In reply to Well, I think the only by Esme
Interesting debate - only
Submitted by AndyT on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 13:22
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
In reply to Interesting debate - only by AndyT
Ho capisco perfettamente Ugo
Submitted by Esme on Fri, 08/03/2012 - 16:00
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
A post to sell a house and I
Submitted by caerus on Sat, 08/04/2012 - 01:45
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
A post to sell a house and I find one of the most interesting debates on the politics and economics of Europe and Italy. Thank you all for the input. Unfortunately while the property is lovely, I can't afford it and like esme it's too big for me. Ugo, I wish you well in pursuing the sale. I think whoever buys it will get a great value.
Lets have a heated debate...
Submitted by Ram on Sat, 08/04/2012 - 03:38
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Its not whether sterling will crash, but if the euro does go belly up, the knock on effects on sterling will be much much greater than any Brit thinks. UK may not have otped into the single currency, but it is effectively bound up in it, and should Europe get deeper into the doodoo, its inevitable that there will be a concomitant sterling hit. Ugo - true, we should not believe everything we read in the papers, but foreign (in this case UK) papers dont tend to write the same amount of utter cr&/p as ones. Journalistic freedom is important, but INVESTIGATIVE journalism, not making up something to sell more copy. The press is on a par with 'Elvis found on Moon' They print appalling hearsay and opinion under the protection of not revealing sources - an important principle but taken to extremes in Italy. And with the huge government subsidies of newspapers that should be defunct, they carry on printing rubbish. A few history books would help alot - you cant understand the present without understanding the past. And again, text books are not exactly unbiased in their history reporting!
history box
Submitted by Ugo on Sat, 08/04/2012 - 06:20
In reply to Lets have a heated debate... by Ram
Ram I agree,the fact is that few people were reading the history books and try to interpret it, accept the most good for what they are told by journalists inquiring. So everyone knows that our Monti increases the taxes of the s, but nobody says that the "good" Cameron, subjected to all the care the children of Albion. So,while anyone with ease, opening an English newspaper, maybe the network, learns all the vicissitudes of the economic situation . Soit is equally difficult to find that Mr. Cameron said the British workers "I'm sorrybut we can not go on the difficult decision we have taken to cut government spending to control deficits and debt. I know it's hard, but know it's hard when you have a debt problem is not the only thing to do is continue to zoom in on that debt. "(Euronews) I found a nice article that talks about RECESSION in england .. I wonder why journalists inquiring, not rely on it .. maybe does not sell copies? maybe if anyone is curious, can 'read it, here. >
I agree. There is nothing new
Submitted by Pat H on Sat, 08/04/2012 - 15:39
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
I agree. There is nothing new in this situation. If you are interested in learning the real reasons behind the mess we are all in read Crisis Economics: A Crash Course in the Future of Finance by Nouriel Roubini one of the very few economists who warned that this was going to happen way before it happened. The causes are not as simplistic as all the journalists would have you believe but it is all just history repeating itself in a different form this time. The other fact that most people glide over very easily is that this is just one set back in the history of Italy (which includes many many setbacks even pre Garibaldi). For a country to build itself up after the decimation of World War 2 to the position it is in now shows a very resilient people. The low personal debt and high personal savings also show a people who have learnt from hundreds of years of famines, wars, invasions, mafia problems etc etc. In fact I remember a great passage in I think it was the brilliant book Midnight In Sicily. The headline in the “The cake is finished” after the mafia had taken all the public money and Italy faced a similar crisis. Well, the cake is now well and truly finished and the situation is so serious that hopefully they will start tackling the structural problems finally. However if they re-elect Berlusconi it will tell you that they still need to learn some lessons.
Berlusconi ..
Submitted by Ugo on Sun, 08/05/2012 - 05:56
In reply to I agree. There is nothing new by Pat H
Hi Pat H Berlusconi maybe not ... but someone here sees the alternatives, do not say good, but simply alternative...? the left in general, without naming names, is suffering an identity crisis. Today, so many heads, that perhaps she herself finds it difficult to find - is the news last night that in the great Di Pietro's party, there are 3 currents with three different ideas on what to do when they grow - Bersani suffers a crisis of acute theocracy (you will not have much .... besides me)-Vendola shortly legislate from prison - The League has imploded, the so-called party of the center, and private fiefdom of a mafia family housing, is ready to sell themselves to the highest bidder. Grillo ... is good for the municipal elections, and perhaps even they will not survive long - Napolitano, has finally reached the end of his term and arteriosclerosis soon I will make a pillar of salt . the reduction of public funding to political parties, will soon present the bill to all the clever, the penniless, the profiteers. I do not think Monti, professor, the more loved by the s, or anyone on his team, have the resources or the will to found a party, on whose luck then, few believe.. I have a sneaking suspicion that the only alternative is to return to the starting point..
Very important issue to this post is EU finance
Submitted by stevegwmonkseaton on Sun, 08/05/2012 - 07:07
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Apart from the fact it has generated so many posts, I don't think this is by any way off track. Despite the price being as suggested above that where a buyer would worry about a Euro collapse, I don't think it is so high that a collapse might be significant to a buy. So some people interested in such a purchase should be warned. It is a pity the article link above from the telegraph is not in , it should be replicated here in Italy for all s to see. It's very good and I think this debt chart shows a better picture as to why Germany and France need the Euro and the impact on Stirling. Something I think elluded to by Ugo, but specifically the UK to not have debt with Italy (Italy do with the UK). Look at where all the major debt of countries in trouble lies. As a financial institution the UK debt situation is misleading, but they are certainly in it if the Euro collapses, which I would say is as high as 50/50 chance. Stirling however will not be impated as serverly as those Euro countries. Which ever way you look at it, unless you have money to burn, intend to always stay put, it's not the time to buy.
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
No it's the same Ugo
Submitted by stevegwmonkseaton on Sun, 08/05/2012 - 08:03.. the reading is in the detail. I had read this article before and the headline is misleading to say the least. It is in fact saying exactly the same thing, many houses are now up for sale, so prices are falling and not many buyers because they are worried about the Euro or waiting for it to collapse and their Striling will in the short term be worth 30% more against the new currency.
In reply to No it's the same Ugo by stevegwmonkseaton
Sorry to take this thread on
Submitted by Rickardo on Sun, 08/05/2012 - 14:31
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Ugo - those circumstances
Submitted by Penny on Sun, 08/05/2012 - 14:57
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Ugo - those circumstances were nothing like now. Major took the UK into the pre-cursor to the Euro and it was a disaster. This time round the UK is no part of it other than the contributions it makes to the IMF, EU etc. No-one can doubt that the UK does a lot of trade with Europe but there are lots of other countries in the world with growing economies unlike Europe that the UK can trade with and unlike Italy they can (and have) down-valued their currency. The only shame is that the UK no longer produces as much as it used to so is very reliant on income from services including the financial sector. Having said all that it is the UK's debt figures that are pretty staggering and the personal debt levels are huge. Whilst the UK is seen by the markets as 'safe' then the UK can borrow at a low interest rate. If that should change then it is in serious do-do. There are not many signs of growth in the economy to help with the deficit and that is what is needed. Whether the current government are up to the job is a whole other topic. Personally I don't see Sterling going anywhere other than gaining strength against the Euro as it has done over the pas 12 months. It has been doing this whilst the Bank of England has effectively been devaluing it with Quantitive Easing. The more worrying thing has nothing to do with money and more to do with what is the social fallout from a Euro going bust? If you look at the history of Germany and the start of the 2nd world war there are some allarming parallels. I have no faith in the European parliament and the rest of them in Brussels to sort out anything. They move too slowly and are obsessed with their pet political project. At what expense?
Nearly there
Submitted by Fillide on Sun, 08/05/2012 - 19:55
In reply to Ugo - those circumstances by Penny
Yes, the BoE have the opportunity to do QE, so does the Fed. They've both done it. The ECB (arguably) doesn't have the authority (aka power) to do any money printing - and obviously EZ Sovereign banks gave up the possibility when they joined with, (in the case of Italy!) great celebration, the Euro. Every country which joined the Eurozone (in my opinion) simply didn't understand that they were being deprived of an accelerator and a brake. The mainstream American investment community didn't understand that there was a difference between a Bund and a Btp - which was pretty stupid of them, because they dived into the higher yeilding sovereign securities like there wasn't any risk. They wanted (still want) to have the benefit of a risk premium but are unwilling to look at a loss. It's easy to 'blame' these manipulators - but they were using politically sensitive money (pension funds of voters), so although they made stupid investment decisions to allow them to suffer any loss is anathema to politicians. But that's only the fundamentals of the difficulties of sovereign debt. If the commercial investment banks (worldwide) were not in so much trouble because they had invented an enormous sackful of what they call 'money', which they sold to each other, and which basically (and realistically) is worth zilch, then they wouldn't have to push their problems onto the sovereigns. But clearly - that is their soft option - because it then becomes political! Whoever siad he admired Roubini - I'm in total agreement. His point of view (in a nutshell) is that fundamentally the whole system (not capitalism, but creditism) is completely fracked. The road along which 'our leaders' are kicking the can might just be infinite - we live in interesting times. As far as I can see, Roubini does not have any concrete suggestions (at least, none which the Germans would countenace). As far as Italy exiting the Euro - there are persuasive voices from the Berlusconi camp (mainly Claudio Borghi, economics editor of Il Giornale) - which suggest that the devaluation resulting from any euroexit are already factored in (as far as sovereign yields are concerned). As a disinterested observer, I'm somewhat inclined to relish the scenario of Spain or Italy effectively squeezing the zit of the Euro, and watching the pus hit the fan.
In reply to Nearly there by Fillide
Fillide , Please forgiveif you are not able to respond to you point by point. Unfortunately my knowledge of English is not great, and my translator, at times, is lost in the maze of your speech, highlighting, only terms related to human diseases with malodorous results, whose thinking in this summer heat is unbearable. In principle are in agreement with your analysis of the situation, and indeed I remember some words of an politician - The Power wears out those who did not - remains clearly understand who, in this global economic situation has REALLY power. To return to the starting point of this topic, my job takes me to touch the real situation of want to invest in Italy, this is because those who call my work, he would bring money with money that would have - for then invest it all in buying a property in Italy - clearly have something nice and maybe an investment that will increase in value over the years. Well,many here will appear strange, but in the last 2 months, the number of these people is growing, over the same period of 2011 - For the record, in decreasing order , applicants come from: England, USA, Russia, Denmark, Sweden, Australia, North Africa
In reply to Ugo - those circumstances by Penny
Penny , This way of thinking is quite typical of the UK, it demonstrates what Europeanist only effectual door, and not when it must engage in first person, this way of acting is sicuramemte coveted by many, but unfortunately it is not allowed by European laws. The creation of Europe as a whole, as is the procreation of the elephant, quick conception, pregnancy infinite. For the birth of the century, the possibility of abortion has not been put into the program, but farmers have already sold the tusks. The fact that the British government enjoys good economic health, while its population is highly indebted, however, has a high negative implication: given that domestic growth is declining, the nation will require short of liquidity to support the costs of public services, not being able to ask its citizens, must supply on the external market, this solution will inevitably raise the rates. The factor in Germany, not to be underestimated, which recalls an old proveb - The wolf lose hair, but not the bad habits - Our wolf, twice already, in recent centuries, has given value to the proverb.
How come you all knows the
Submitted by Rickardo on Mon, 08/06/2012 - 17:31
In reply to A newbie all over again! by Annec
Latest property in Umbria
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